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OpenBuilds OX CNC Machine

Discussion in 'CNC Mills/Routers' started by kram242, Dec 15, 2013.

OpenBuilds OX CNC Machine

OpenBuilds OX CNC Machine

Discussion in 'CNC Mills/Routers' started by kram242, Dec 15, 2013.

OpenBuilds OX CNC Machine. A strong easy to build shop CNC router that can be sized to suit your needs. Many new features have been incorporated into the OX to make it a great router that is sure to inspire!

Page 5 of 35
  1. Gopal

    Gopal Journeyman Builder

    Indeed the motor current tops out at 3A on the TinyG which is a shame.
    The tgFX is also in the development stages and is a little buggy. I am looking at loading GRBL onto an UNO or the DUE and see if I can get the Gcode onto a SD card.
    The other possibility is to interface it to an iPAD which would be awsome.

    My interest (as a newly retired person -am 68yrs) is doing some 3D photo carving and the OX is perfect for that. (I may need a little more than 70mm Z travel but that's the beauty of your design - it can be modified. Thanks for all your contributions.
    Gopal, Jan 13, 2014
    #121
    Robert Hummel likes this.
  2. Robert Hummel

    Robert Hummel Custom Builder Staff Member Builder

    The 20x40 for the z axis, is it open/no plate at the bottom?
    I ask cause the RC spindle I'm making will bolt to the bottom of a 20x40 with m5 screws
    Here's a pic, still putting it together
    image.jpg
    Robert Hummel, Jan 13, 2014
    #122
    kram242 likes this.
  3. kram242

    kram242 OpenBuilds Team Staff Member Builder

    Hello @Gopal and all (A bit of an update)
    Thank you for your kind words and congrats on your retirement :)
    Funny you should mention that ( about being modified) as I have been looking for ways to increase the over all strength for Z axis cutting. The Ox it not intended to be an end all CNC router but instead more of a functional fun to build learning experience that hopefully will inspire ideas to incorporate into other designs. For me, I am constantly working and changing as I go so there will be differences to the original design by the time I reach the end of any build and I hope you guys are the same way. This is what will push a design to be the best it can be.
    So on to the most recent changes.
    I found that the majority of materials that will be used on this machine will range from 1/4" to 3/4" realistically you would not need more room under the X rail then this. there are times when you may want to so some thicker foam carvings for instance, but these could be split in half to do both sides and this is very rare job.

    So as a test and an attempt to bring the X beam down closer to the material. I have redesigned the side plates to move the motors to the bottom (like the Routy) and this opens up room on the side plates to allow me to lower the X beam down about 30mm. However the problem with this design change is that it locks us into a pretty shallow X beam to material height, and thats no good even though it would help with lowing the over all profile and give us some strength there had to be a better way with out making such drastic proprietary changes.

    So where we are now is not to make any changes other then the ability to bring the bed up to close the gap on on the Z axis. This will allow for all kinds of neat things like larger foam carving 3D stuff (with a single bed layer), Cutting woods (with a double 3/4 bed) and even the room to add a vacuum hold down system. And if you want to get adventurous there is always the possibility of removing the bed and adding a 4th rotary axis as well :)
    So this is the way we are heading now and we will see how it goes. I like this way because there is little to no change on the machine up to this point. If you want a new bed on the machine you simply put it on and keep working the job. i think in the long run it makes the OX a more versatile machine they we original though it to be and thats a good thing :)
    So at this point moving forward with the build as is, with multiple different interchangeable bed designs in the future. :D
    We are working on the videos and hope to have something to share soon.
    kram242, Jan 13, 2014
    #123
  4. kram242

    kram242 OpenBuilds Team Staff Member Builder

    As it is its not open but I am sure you could make it work with a little drilling :) That looks great! @Robert Hummel
    kram242, Jan 13, 2014
    #124
    Robert Hummel likes this.
  5. Gopal

    Gopal Journeyman Builder

    As crazy as dreams tend to go, I was thinking of using dual spindle on the same drive!!!
    Humans tend to associate beauty with symmetry - if your left-right facial features are symmetrical then you can be a model! So, I thought if I had dual spindle doing mirror image of a pattern on the same carving things can shine a bit.

    The reason to RAISE the gantry is to see if I can do some cylindrical carving using a rotary axis below--

    You guys are the doers at this point and I am happy to be part of this.. Retirement can really push you into some crazy thinking modes - you know the saying about idle mind..
    Gopal, Jan 13, 2014
    #125
    Robert Hummel likes this.
  6. Robert Hummel

    Robert Hummel Custom Builder Staff Member Builder

    This is kinda what I was drawing out while my mill did the cutting I think it will work out.
    As they say ya don't know till you try :)
    image.jpg
    Please excuse the art skills lol
    image.jpg
    Enough with the pics I'm going to spoil the build lol
    Robert Hummel, Jan 13, 2014
    #126
    Gopal and kram242 like this.
  7. kram242

    kram242 OpenBuilds Team Staff Member Builder

    kram242, Jan 13, 2014
    #127
  8. Robert Hummel

    Robert Hummel Custom Builder Staff Member Builder

    Thats what Open builds is to me man, a place where my mind can grow and feed off all the great minds alike here.
    OPENBUILDS Rocks!
    Cant wait to have an OX flinging chips
    I may also go with ten tpi leadscrews that I came accross, 500mm thread travel
    Robert Hummel, Jan 13, 2014
    #128
    kram242 likes this.
  9. Gopal

    Gopal Journeyman Builder

    Looks great! All good designs start on the back of coffeeshop brown knapkins.
    Have you thought about using the PM rotor and stator coils cannibalized from brushless RC outboard motors?
    Also, keep in mind of lateral chatter/resonance at high RPM... but I would be the last person to suggest paralysis thru analysis!
    Gopal, Jan 13, 2014
    #129
    Robert Hummel likes this.
  10. sli

    sli Well-Known Builder

    Hey. Is it possible to get the files to the new OX CNC Plates?

    Thanks
    sli, Jan 15, 2014
    #130
    Mopar32985 likes this.
  11. kram242

    kram242 OpenBuilds Team Staff Member Builder

    Hi @sli the OX build is still a build in progress, but once complete all the files will be posted.
    kram242, Jan 15, 2014
    #131
  12. Glenn West

    Glenn West Well-Known Builder

    Glenn West, Jan 15, 2014
    #132
    kram242 likes this.
  13. Gopal

    Gopal Journeyman Builder

    Mark, have you looked at these from a company called ITEM.



    As everyone else here, waiting to see when the plates would be available from the parts store. Being slightly on the impatience side, I have already ordered the V-slots, other structural mounting plates and ordered six 270 oz-in Nema 23 steppers and two spindle motors (300w and 800w with E11 collets).

    I do have a question though, do you really thing a dual NEMA23 for the y is necessary? For my application I need eaqual x-y force at the spindle. I was thinking to split the two 20/60 on the gantry and two belt runs with the z installed in between-any caution from you?????

    -Gopal
    Gopal, Jan 15, 2014
    #133
  14. Gopal

    Gopal Journeyman Builder

    I forgot to mention: On the drive electronic side, I have the TinyG 6axes bord (https://synthetos.myshopify.com/products/tinyg) interfaced to tgFX drive software (the latest build is at https://www.dropbox.com/sh/huiupgemipv8f4q/X2l_1EH-gx for Windows - it runs fine on Win7 x64 although the s/w is for 32bit).

    For me TinyG allows me to map A/B/C axes to X/Y/Z thus use two spindles with steppers slaved on X and the two Y steppers also slaved. The interesting part of these two H/W & S/W combination is that they can be run on OSX as well and hopefully an iPAD with wireless interface. DREAMS!

    Gopal
    Gopal, Jan 16, 2014
    #134
    Mopar32985 likes this.
  15. Mopar32985

    Mopar32985 Journeyman Builder

    I have to admit im with you Gopal. I have ordered all the parts for the OX minus a few little things and also cant wait to get the frames cut or templates and might try to just cut them out without CNC. Just last night i got my Hobbycnc board hooked up to my computer and got all the steppers running. Just got me that much more excited to get this machine built.
    Mopar32985, Jan 16, 2014
    #135
  16. kram242

    kram242 OpenBuilds Team Staff Member Builder

    Hi @Gopal cool videos and cool ideas. I have seen the pbc video in the past but the item one is new to me and interesting. Thanks for the share. :)
    I think that is a great idea Gopal! It could be something along the lines of the Mechmate cnc router. I like the idea and am looking forward to see how you put it to use in your V-Slot build. This is the nice thing about OpenBuilds everyone can modify and tweak until we find the best machine for the application. The way I am building it may be completely different from the next guy but we can compare results take the best of both worlds and make a new machine that is twice as good as both of the originals!
    images.jpg
    kram242, Jan 16, 2014
    #136
  17. kram242

    kram242 OpenBuilds Team Staff Member Builder

    Working on the videos and almost complete the wiring. So next is software and then send it off to Youtube. :)
    kram242, Jan 16, 2014
    #137
    Robert Hummel likes this.
  18. wrdutcher

    wrdutcher Well-Known Builder

    The RT0700C has been replaced with the RT0701C. You can pick it up at Home Depot for $99.00. I like that it has a electronic speed control range of 10k-30k rpm. May be ideal for harder materials.
    wrdutcher, Jan 16, 2014
    #138
  19. kram242

    kram242 OpenBuilds Team Staff Member Builder

    and good throwing chips instead of melting them in cutting plastics as well
    kram242, Jan 16, 2014
    #139
  20. Gopal

    Gopal Journeyman Builder

    It's been only a few months since I jumped into this hobby (!) and my findings on the net may all have been seen by most of you. So my apologies if my postings and ideas are blasé to many of you.

    The difference I think between Mechmate cnc and mine would be that mine would have TWO independent spindle with two steppers on X axis running code but operate in mirror fashion - don't know if I am all wet here! The x axis will be a single belt-pinion drive à la except the steppers would run in opposite sense. Might have to use wider belt just in case.

    But all these are just buzzing in my head. I am anxiously waiting for you second part video on the OX and the optimizations you will certainly do. Being new to all this, I will first try to put your design first before forking off to my craziness!!!

    So, thank you for publishing all these and it won't be long before you turn me also into an expert like you - but for now I am an ardent follower of you.
    Gopal
    Gopal, Jan 16, 2014
    #140
  21. Mopar32985

    Mopar32985 Journeyman Builder

    Sounds great mark can't wait to watch it
    Mopar32985, Jan 16, 2014
    #141
    kram242 likes this.
  22. The Dude

    The Dude Veteran Builder

    Dude, are you in India? I'd love to see someone take this there and get a distributor for parts. Maybe even get some fair trade going and cut out the corporations, just go person to person. You know, free market something like that. Plus India has so many EE and CS people now it would help us a lot.
    The Dude, Jan 17, 2014
    #142
  23. Gopal

    Gopal Journeyman Builder

    So sorry.. I am in North Carolina - have been in the US & UK for the past 40years - I am 68 now.... Not been to India in a long while!!!
    Gopal, Jan 17, 2014
    #143
  24. Glenn West

    Glenn West Well-Known Builder

    Good news is Singapore is a cross roads for India, we have a good size of India Population, and people regularly come to Singapore to buy and bring back. I'm almost thru getting setup for being a OpenBuiilds Distri here.
    Planning on OX kits, and fully assembled.

    Have to checkout and see if there's a maker fair in India.
    Glenn West, Jan 17, 2014
    #144
    kram242 likes this.
  25. matt_o_70

    matt_o_70 Well-Known Builder

    Mark,
    I have some material that - I'll happily use to Alpha test any part files you have for the side plates :)

    I am looking for motor packages and am trying to decide between a NEMA 23 that seems in line with a 2'x4' machine or your thoughts if this can handle much larger motor package? I think I recall you mentioning a desire for 23's for the side plates in your Part1 video?

    Based on your experience with Routy and Ox what do you think is sweet spot for motor size?

    185 oz-in
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/321284383152?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

    287 oz-in (Nice clean enclosed driver board)
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/221344427902?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

    428 oz-in - this is one option if looking for more than 3A from the stepper driver. Would this be overkill for an Ox based mechanical package???
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/140902769594?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
    matt_o_70, Jan 18, 2014
    #145
  26. Gopal

    Gopal Journeyman Builder

    For whatever it is worth, I have heard that (not used personally) the controllers based on T6560 have some reliability problems. Besides the interface is parallel port - check if you have one on your computer!

    I use TinyG ($130) which has 4 axis drive with the 4th axis mappable to the other three. It is fully self contained (can take any Gcode sent via USB and drive the motors) It can drive up to about 2.2amp/phase without any heatsink (the chips are rated for 2.5amp max but I hate to use max rating on anything!!). Synthetos who makes these suggest fan cooling than use any heat sink. And they claim to have tested this board with 17 & 23 motors. By the way, they also have an Arduino shield if you prefer that route. And , best of all, its open sourced.

    But if you want to try ebay look for controllers with TB6600 chips. Interface (USB or Prallelport) should be decided by what computer you have). You can instead buy the steppers on ebay for about half that price, and use US built TinyG. (I have only had some critical discussions with Synthetos so please don't assume that I have any vested interest in the product except that more people end up using the TinyG the better the product will eventually be)

    As for sizing the steppers, higher torque means faster movement of the axis. This also depends on the load you have on the X-Y axes (defined by friction on the bearings - minimal for the OX) and the spindle motor and the work you want to do. If you want to do deep cuts @ high feedrate on hard material then you do need the 270 0z-inch motors. Also keep in mind that at max roll out, the belts also tend to stretch. Zaxis on the OX is safe as it has an acme thread where you do get some mechanical advatage of the leadscrew.

    I am certain Mark can explain this better as he has personal experiece with belt-pinion drives. I DO NOT!

    Sorry for this all hypothetical cautions - I am a physicist and this comes out of being one.
    Gopal
    Gopal, Jan 19, 2014
    #146
  27. Robert Hummel

    Robert Hummel Custom Builder Staff Member Builder

    Yes indeed! stay away from TB6560 boards.
    I myself had many issues and the z axis chip exploded.
    I ended up salvaging the parts and building my own controller from the remaining TB6560 IC's.
    image.jpg

    In the end it cost me more to get the junk I was sold to work nice but also learned to make my own PCBs.
    Robert Hummel, Jan 19, 2014
    #147
  28. Public Do Omens

    Public Do Omens Veteran Builder

    G-code logger idea, nice.

    With my designs i just would code this with the Atmel chip so it uses a I2C LCD to show the current G-code in operation.
    Arduino rules. I have a GertDuino that sits on-top of my Raspberry Pi with HDMI & USB & Ethernet all for £30

    SD card provides the G-code card input. So no PC required.
    Plus the designs can be locked on a SD card.
    This way you make SD cards for the shop once, then lock them down.

    This helps separate the CAM process & the manufacturing side.
    Very handy when working with people whom don't understand computer systems.
    Public Do Omens, Jan 19, 2014
    #148
  29. matt_o_70

    matt_o_70 Well-Known Builder

    Thanks for the feedback guys.. I have been reading up on the TinyG board at the forums and am considering it for sure.

    Robert your board work is inspiring.. I'd love to know how to do that kind of work
    matt_o_70, Jan 19, 2014
    #149
  30. Robert Hummel

    Robert Hummel Custom Builder Staff Member Builder

    Ty, it's not that hard at all just takes practice and a lot of reading.
    I just got so mad I said to myself if they can make it so can I :)

    I started out with the iron technic and got ok results but success rates where low. Here is a video of me making my little girls nightlight


    I built an exposure unit using an Arduino Uno and put the code together using bits and bites from many different sketches.
    I know very little when it comes to programing, just a good hack lol
    This allowed me to get fine traces and 100% success etching boards

    I'm about to dive into SMD PCBs to make my own Arduino based controller for my OX build.
    Should be fun and in the end I hope to have a solid 4 axis 4.5 amp GRBL based controller.
    Robert Hummel, Jan 19, 2014
    #150
    kram242 likes this.
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